"BadMotorScooter" (badmotorscooter)
10/18/2018 at 14:15 • Filed to: Cadillac, denali, Pickup, luxury pickup
3
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"BadMotorScooter" (badmotorscooter)
10/18/2018 at 14:15 • Filed to: Cadillac, denali, Pickup, luxury pickup | 3
| 32 |
I’ve been wondering lately, with the never-ending rise of luxuriousness and price of pickup trucks, if there isn’t a case to be made for a Cadillac pickup. I don’t mean an Escalade EXT SUV-truck thing, but a full-on pickup truck.
GMC has the Denali line on 1500, 2500, and 3500 trucks and they sell like hotcakes. Denali sells so well that GMC added an “Ultimate Package” option to increase the profit value even further. A new 2019 Sierra Denali 1500 with Ultimate Package and 6.2 V8 tops out around $70k MSRP. It can go even higher with additional accessories and dealer add-ons. There still seems room to go on the top-end of the luxury truck market.
Cadillac could market a new half-ton crew-cab short-bed 4WD truck with all of the luxury trimmings of the Denali Ultimate, plus some Cadillac premium features like ultra-high quality leather interior. Maybe some additional tech like Super Cruise and infotainment. They could give it a different exterior design with some distinctive LED lighting and bling to show everyone else you didn’t settle for the Denali (like the Escalade).
To really set it off, the Cadillac truck should offer the only way to get the LT4 supercharged 650hp V8 in a truck. Pair it with the new 10-speed transmission, and mandatory 4WD or AWD. This would give people a real reason to spend the extra money and step up from the GMC Denali. It would make the truck truly aspirational and the top of the luxury truck market. I could see a fully optioned Cadillac truck with the LT4 hit $100k. The Escalade Platinum is already there, and it doesn’t differentiate its powertrain from the Yukon Denali.
Now, what to call it? If Cadillac wants to stick to the alphanumeric scheme, I’d go with TK1 for the 1500. Or leverage a new real name that means the highest peak of truckness - “Everest” perhaps? Or leverage a historical name that recalls Cadillac luxury but also implies American ruggedness - Fleetwood. Not many new truck buyers today know what a Fleetwood was anyway.
What else would be better for Cadillac to offer the American market, where the German and Japanese competitors can’t or don’t compete. Plus they could easily add the Cadillac 2500 and 3500 pickup line with Duramax and LT4 options to create the ultra-high end heavy-duty luxury truck market.
HoustonRunner
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:18 |
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If you make the suggestion I think you should provide a rendering as well....
Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:20 |
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I say they shouldn’t. And not because it wouldn’t sell. It would take away some of the premium that they want the GMC brand to have. Further, GMC has name recognition within trucks and they dont want to tarnish that either.
nj959
> HoustonRunner
10/18/2018 at 14:31 |
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I got you:
Damn I’m good.
RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:32 |
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I would disagree - the GMC has always slotted into GM’s Cadillac of pickups sort of position anyway , and with the current trend toward “ humble” names being optioned out the yingyang (*cough, Ford King Ranch*), GMC is already a fancy enough badge. What I see happening if they were to do that would be that the Cadillacs wouldn’t sell in big numbers, just enough that some would get an extra $5k over the GMC from GMC customers while costing $7k more to make ... until excess supply made them drop in price to move off the lot and cannibalize the GMC sales further.
I don’t think they get any *new* sales with a Cadillac truck, is what I’m saying... or not enough to pay for the effort when concomitant GMC sniping is taken into account. I could be wrong, given that they somehow manage to sell GMC and Cadillac SUVs, but the Companion Make Program looked like it worked at first too. As much as a Cadillac SUV market exists, I think it’s far too urban-centric to sell pickups, and selling a half-truck to people in the Cadillac dealer while selling a half-truck to people in the truck dealer (GMC) is something you can imagine coexisting, where a full truck in the Cadillac dealer or a full Cadillac at the truck dealer would both be a bridge too far.
The joker in the deck is the extent to which modern four door cabs have replaced the BOF sedan market position, but I think the Escalade and Escalade EXT have probably already tapped that out. On the other hand, I could see success on the basis of being a “luxury coupe pickup”. Maybe. Not sure that does better on a truck platform or a car platform.
OPPOsaurus WRX
> HoustonRunner
10/18/2018 at 14:33 |
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o o o i got this one please hold
CRider
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:34 |
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Everest isn’t really the name that comes to mind when I think ‘highest peak of trucks’.
And I don’t think a Cadillac truck would sell. The EXT, Lincoln Blackwood and MKT never sold. Lux truck buyers want to buy into the image of a truck, not the image of a luxury car that happens to be a truck. And it would cost a lot of money to not make it just a rebadge of a Denali. People are obviously willing to pay up for a Ford, Ram or GMC with every luxury option, why devalue the Denali brand because you think you can get a few grand more for a Cadillac?Plus, people that go into a dealer for a Denali might get some sticker shock, so can walk to the other side of the lot and look at a cheaper GMC or Silverado. A Cadillac dealer might not want to down sell you into a cheaper brand, if they are even attached to a GMC dealer at all.
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OPPOsaurus WRX
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:35 |
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this was a rendering someone on here requested a while ago. Its based on the Colorado.
Alfalfa
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 14:43 |
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I you took a Denali, did nothing but change the front fascia and badges, all the truck guys would say how dumb it is to make a work vehicle a Cadillac. Then they would go buy the exact same truck that says "GMC".
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HoustonRunner
> OPPOsaurus WRX
10/18/2018 at 14:59 |
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That would give me nightmares if I saw it on the road. Not unlike an Escalate EXT...
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HoustonRunner
> nj959
10/18/2018 at 15:00 |
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Honestly, that is better than I could have done.
shop-teacher
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 15:51 |
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I’m going to disagree with everybody else here, and say that would sell these days. Frankly, GM is leaving money on the table here.
Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 16:13 |
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I had a similar thought and agree with you 100%. A Cadillac Truck (and a Lincoln too) would sell well if done right in today’s market.
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Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
> OPPOsaurus WRX
10/18/2018 at 16:23 |
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That was me, still like it too!
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BadMotorScooter
> RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
10/18/2018 at 16:29 |
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Solid argument there! One could have said the same thing about a Denali truck line, or GMC overall, when there are all the standard Sierras and Silverados that offer the same thing for less money.
If Escalade Platinum , Denali Ultimate, and Ford King Ranch tell us anything it is that there is demand on the high end. I don’t think it is tapped out yet.
The key to the Cadillac truck is to di ff erentiate it enough from the Denali. The LT4 option and unique (really cool) lighting would be enough. Truck buyers like to show off and want functionality (look at Raptor) , so the unique powertrain and signature lighting would do the trick. Plus every other bell and whistle they could throw at it.
Hmm, a “luxury coupe pickup”.... so its called Eldorado!
jasmits
> shop-teacher
10/18/2018 at 16:32 |
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Sell, yes.
But would it generate any new sales that wouldn’t have otherwise gone to whatever the fanciest GMC is called these days or the Escalade? I don’t really think so.
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BadMotorScooter
> CRider
10/18/2018 at 16:34 |
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I think they key would be to differentiate the Cadillac truck with a unique powertrain, styling, and options. If the only way to get an LT4, signature high-end cool lighting and design, and maybe super cruise was the Cadillac then you’d have a reason for people to choose the Cadillac or choose to pay less for a Denali with only the 6.2. The Ca di-truck would be low volume but high price and margin.
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BadMotorScooter
> Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap
10/18/2018 at 16:36 |
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GMC remains GMC. Even as Cadillac sells Escalades beside GMC Yukon Denalis that are less differentiated than the proposed Cadillac truck.
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BadMotorScooter
> Alfalfa
10/18/2018 at 16:38 |
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Right, which is why the Cadi-truck needs to have different powertrain, lighting & design, and some exclusive options like super cruise. If the Cadillac was the only way to get the 650hp LT4 in a truck, people would buy in and wouldn’t diminish Denali for less money.
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RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 16:44 |
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There’s a difference between “premium GMC”/”premium Chevy” badging that is sold to people looking for specifically a Chevy or a GMC (“A Chevy, but less gauche”), compared with playing Russian Roulette Rebadge. I’m also not saying it wouldn’t have purchasers, but rather that it would likely be a wash financially at best. The advantage to the Raptor is that as a FORD above all else it doesn’t matter if it’s financially a wash on paper as long as it plays a halo car role, which I really don’t see happening with a Cadillac pickup. Also, it had the “factory offroader that *does* something” trick up its sleeve.
A luxury coupe pickup Coupe de Ville is called a Mirage.
With a Cadillac “real pickup”, the customer is known: people who are currently buying the Denali Ultimate and some people currently buying the Escalade Platinum. With something like this, the market is “I have no idea”. Could be nobody, like the SSR. Could be way more than nobody. As opposed to financial “meh”, likely to be financially insane.
But it would be cool.
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RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 16:47 |
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There’s also the Cadillac Paris:
And the Cadillac Caribou:
The Mirage was more professionally executed and supported by Cadillac, though.
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shop-teacher
> jasmits
10/18/2018 at 18:21 |
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Probably, but if they sell the Caddy for more money, t hen there will be more profit.
ranwhenparked
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 18:37 |
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I really question whether it would work. I still think part of the appeal of a pickup truck is the ability to project a blue collar, masculine image - even if its a Brougham’ed out, leather upholstered, $60,000 land yacht with a bed. It still has a blue oval, ram’s head, bow tie, or “professional grade” GMC badge on the front, just like ranchers and construction workers drive. A large part of driving a pickup is sort of a cosplay thing, there’s an image that buyers want to project to the world. I question if a luxury badge would do that.
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BadMotorScooter
> ranwhenparked
10/18/2018 at 19:24 |
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Maybe, but I remember when the 2500 and 3500 heavy-duty trucks got the Denali luxury option. I thought it was sissyfying the big diesel bro trucks, including the dually. Turns out they were a huge hit and The Truck to have - the more options and features the better. None of the Denali treatment took anything away from the functionality so you could still get a 4WD Duramax 1-ton dually, just with more luxury. I see the same here with Cadillac. Give it an aggressive and showy/cool design with unique lighting and a unique engine option (650HP LT4) and it would be THE truck to get. Don’t weaken it or reduce functionality - just make it more. Like the old Cadillacs...
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ranwhenparked
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 20:09 |
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Well, the secret to the Denalis are that they are still GMCs, so they still let you pretend that you’re the sort of guy that goes hunting and brings home a deer in the bed, or goes to work on a job site in a hardhat and come home with dirt under your nails.
I mean, if anyone can pull off a luxury brand truck, it would probably be Cadillac, since they are more of a “working man’s” luxury car. Back in the day, it wasn’t unheard of for middle class and working class people to save for years in order to buy themselves a Cadillac as a retirement present - which they would garage keep and wax regularly and baby for the rest of their lives as their Sunday go to church car. A Cadillac truck would have a better shot than, say, a Mercedes or Lexus truck, but I still think most people in that price range would prefer a Chevy or GMC badge on the grille.
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CRider
> BadMotorScooter
10/18/2018 at 21:24 |
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You could still put that engine in the Denali (or some other sport trim) and charge extra for it, Chevy still wouldn’t have it so you maintain the illusion of exclusivity GMC has . The Raptor sells well as a $70k Ford , the Ram TRX (or whatever Helltruck they’re going to come out with) doesn’t need to sell under another brand, and people will obviously pay up for a GMC brand truck . Supercruise is a technology that isn’t going to stay exclusive within Cadillac for long, either, and GMC is a luxury brand almost as much as Cadillac is nowadays. Plus, unless it was a V model, the LT4 isn’t really what Cadillac is about. They want to use their own Cadillac specific engines now , not just Corvette motors detuned for the application and that would be hard to justify for the numbers the Truckillac would sell.
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jasmits
> shop-teacher
10/18/2018 at 23:49 |
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Shit, I just priced both out and as much as I loathe the idea of a Caddy pickup you might be right. The Sierra 1500 actually tops off more around $65k than $70K and the Escalade ESV starts(STARTS!) at almost $80k and I see those tasteless things around a decent amount . ( My fuck I had no idea they were that expensive, have rich people these days not heard of Range Rovers!? Or are Range Rovers just not nearly vulgar enough? ) It could fit in there for the kinda guy who has no need for a pickup truck but wants to have the “football d ad” image instead of the “soccer mom” image. Ick.
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shop-teacher
> jasmits
10/19/2018 at 07:21 |
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Yeah, I see lots of Escalades around here too. Actually, my neighbor two doors down (nice guy, has a 4-speed stepside Squarebody in his garage) traded a previous gen Escalade for a loaded Denali crew cab, so he could have something better suited for towing his big ass boat (since traded for a big ass camper). I bet he would’ve went for an extra $20g's for a Caddy pickup, if he had the choice. I think a fair number of others would too.
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jasmits
> shop-teacher
10/19/2018 at 11:35 |
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You’re probably right, I just don’t understand. Frankly even if I had an unlimited budge t if I were in the market for a big SUV I’d take a Yukon Denali over an Escalade. Just as luxurious and I think way, way better looking. What I’d actually have is a Range Rover, but I guess if I needed the extra seats for some reason.
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shop-teacher
> jasmits
10/19/2018 at 12:17 |
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I would take the Denali myself. I don’t have the patience to deal with the constant servicing of a Range Rover as they age.
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jasmits
> shop-teacher
10/19/2018 at 14:17 |
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I do!
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shop-teacher
> jasmits
10/19/2018 at 14:19 |
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I salute you!
HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
> ranwhenparked
12/13/2018 at 13:16 |
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This is a good point. My wife refuses to own a BMW, Mini, or Cadillac because she doesn’t want t o seem fancy.I think she’s not alone int that feeling.